When Will Women Acknowledge Their Own Evil?

In the struggle for better understanding between genders, in the struggle to understand relationships, one thing that I feel is greatly missing is women’s acknowledgement of their own sex’s acts of evil. Men are an easy target; men are the majority of political leaders throughout history, the majority of criminal leaders, instigators of wars, etc etc. We all know this. Yet even though modern feminists sometimes acknowledge that women abuse, neglect or even murder children, they don’t really own any responsibility for this.

I recently watched a horror movie about a serial killer. In the movie the man was clearly abused as a child by his father in disturbing ways–and yet the movie does not absolve him of the responsibility for his adult actions. He has become a monster; we are not asked by the movie maker to sympathize with this adult man, what we see is a cause, not a justification.

Feminism fails humanity in that it does not make this connection. If feminism were making such a movie about a woman it would be one of those movies where the killer is really a demon called the Patriarchy. Because of this demon Patriarchy women themselves commit no evil acts. The utter necessity of a mother’s role in a child’s life has no bearing on how they were raised in and of itself–because the demon Patriarchy makes it impossible to judge their actions. If they were free of the demon Patriarchy they would be entirely pure.

This simply puts the onus on men to be subservient to feminism. Feminists do not even address women who abuse children or their spouses or others in their lives except as being victims of the Patriarchy.

We’ve all seen the model: women are strongly encouraged by feminists to feel that their chief sin is being a doormat, not loving their own hearts. In some cases this may be true, but in fact it is the ONLY acceptable scenario. It’s interesting that if you make a search on yahoo for “Abusive Women” there are one and a half pages on that subject overwhelming search hits for “abused women”. I stopped around page six.

I don’t think anyone in the general men’s movement denies that women get abused, or that it is wrong that it happens. Feminists, however, blame the Patriarchy for everything, and thus take no responsibility for their own actions towards others, nor do they encourage other women to do so.

An interesting example of this is found where feminists within the Church reexamine the story of Adam and Eve. They see blaming Eve as being terribly wrong and something that led to the abuse of women. The odd thing about this is that most theologies blame both Adam and Eve, and hold them equally guilty. Requiring, for example, women to submit themselves to their husbands because Eve sinned first isn’t saying that women need to be doormats–it means that women need to curb their desire to believe that all their feelings are valid in favour of doing good, because Eve put her own curiousity and desire before her relationship with God. On the other hand, Adam seems to have been rather passive during the whole thing, and therefore men are urged to be proactive, to seek to do good. These things are a mirror of one another, starting from different positions and seeking to be united in the same position.

I can understand why morality is rejected by feminism. First of all, it is an ideology with its roots in skepticism of the status quo. Fair enough. And the Church hardly has a pristine history. But we can’t rest at saying “the devil (or the Patriarchy) made me do it”. I don’t think anyone needs to respect them while they refuse to accept that women are responsible for the evils that they do.

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21 thoughts on “When Will Women Acknowledge Their Own Evil?

  1. I have some disagreement with you, Sojourner. I remember in one of the Espistles there is a quote that says ‘Eve was deceived’. I can’t remember the actual book, chapter or verse.

    The following is part of a comment I left at Dalrock’s yesterday in response to another comment left by ‘Some Guy’:

    My free advice is that men and women are different and process faith and religion differently.

    Women process religion as feelings. Jesus loves me! I am so close to God! It feels good! I think we have both encountered women who devoutly worship the Holy Trinity of me! me! me!

    Men do religion to know what is true and false, what is good and evil, what must I do to be worthy of the promises of God? Am I in a state of sin, and what must I do to be worthy of salvation?

    This is one of the reasons why you are being raked over the coals. Your pastor knows, even if he doesn’t articulate it, that your wife is incapable of examing her own conscience, therefore it is all on your shoulders. It’s not fair, but God knows we live in a fallen world.

    In terms of salvation, women do not come factory equipped with a conscience. The manosphere is full of references to the ‘rationalisation hamster’. Women can always come up with a reason with why God is cool with what they have done. I do not believe that God holds women eternally accountable for their sins.

    We are men. We come with a conscience. That is why you are being asked to change. We bear the eternal guilt of our unrepented sins. You may, in the near future, go through a foretaste of the blackest pits of Hell. Jesus was and is a Man, as are you. Your near future must be faced with courage and fortitude. God has your back, but there may be many times when He will seem to have abandoned you.

  2. God has given women enough sense so that we are able to repent and confess of our own sins. We are all sinful, no one is worthy, not one.

  3. Joel and Kathy…blechblechblech.

    SunshineMary brought up the young woman who not only blamed her husband and let him blame himself for her having a full on affair, but then gets to drag him through it every time she offers her testimony in her ministry.

    I disagree completely that women have no consciences. Romans 12:12-15 as a for instance.

    I attended a church service once where youth pastor was offering a confession and insights about his porn problems. He shared the pulpit with his wife. In response to some question about the how each of them sinned, youth pastor owned it. Wife’s sins were only related to her husband’s sins.

    I disagree that most theologies express the belief that Adam and Eve are equally guilty. “The Silence of Adam” is a very strongly held belief. Problem is, Adam was ultimately responsible for the fall of humanity. It would be interesting to know what would have happened had Adam not eaten of the fruit. Would Eve have been transformed somehow? Would SHE have been kicked out of the Garden and another suitable helpmeet been created? How many ribs could he give up without caving in? 🙂 None of that changes the fact that Eve sinned first.

    Side topic – I brought it up on someone else’s blog. I don’t believe that sin and temptation occur in a vacuum. I really do believe that temptation is presented according to how we are created. Jesus was tempted according to his birthright. Satan didn’t tempt him with hot chicks. He tempted him with his standing as the Son of God. Coming back to Adam. Some like to think that Adam’s expression when presented with Eve was something along the lines of “Hubba Hubba”. If true, man’s created nature is to be smitten with his woman. Indeed, scripture calls for it. So Adam responding as he did to Eve’s offer of fruit was, in my mind, all part of the plan. Adam couldn’t resist Eve, Eve couldn’t resist the serpent. So…what documented created part of Eve was exploited by the serpent?

  4. “To each their own”

    What so many women fail to realize is that they are responsible for their own evils. It’s disheartening to know that women find other things to justify their evil doings or in some cases blame someone else for something they can’t do. Anyhow the whole Eve sinned first is completely ruled out in the church. I’ve been to plenty of churches that focus on Adam’s sin and no Eve’s sin. I’ve thought about this for a long time and I believe that if Adam would have chosen not to sin, God would have killed her or simply kicked her out the garden. And as I think about it more, Love her like Christ loves the church comes to my mind. Which Christ laid his life down for the church therefore I believe the story of Adam and Eve mimics this.

  5. Which Christ laid his life down for the church therefore I believe the story of Adam and Eve mimics this.

    I have significant issues with this thought, but will also admit that it came to mind. Problem is, Christ laid down his life to redeem the church, not to wallow in sin with it.

  6. I agree completely. I have no idea what Adam had in mind when he sinned but could this have played a role. Let’s be honest how often do we find ourselves doing what Adam did and that is protecting women even though they are wrong. There are many things but the bottom line is that they both sinned. However Adam prolly knew what God was going to do with the woman and did what he did to protect her. He could have done it because of he saw that it didn’t kill her. We’ll never know this answer.

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  8. This is of course true. And there are some women who do have and exercise that sense. But there are many who don’t. I’d actually say that if outright asked, most women would fully admit,on an individual basis, that they are capable of sinning. But when we start to look “big picture” at overall trends and societal issues, we see, especially within the church, an underlying notion that most of the problems are somehow more the fault of men. Look at the “ministry” that I mentioned before. You can, if you look, find others that while not going anywhere near as far, have the same basic message.

  9. Another illustration of the idea that a woman’s sins are usually only a result of the man’s is the movie Fireproof. His anger and porn use were portrayed as completely wrong, as they should have been. However, her emotional affair was portrayed more as an understandable response to his sins. No it wasn’t outright excused, and there was on little bit where it was specifically called wrong, but overall it’s wrong was definitely treated much more “softly” than his wrongs were.

  10. That’s the thing it was justified. That’s like me saying since she isn’t giving it up, I’ll go find someone else that will. Sin is Sin and there is not justification for it.

  11. Even Paul tells us that he does not do the good he would do, but rather the evil he would not do. If Paul was in that position in the first century, what chance do I have of being any better now? The answer, before anyone else tells me is a nice round zero.

    @Chaz345 Great to ‘meet’ you again. One thing that struck me from Fireproof is that the wife’s friends were quick to condemn her husband for making her feel unhappy, but there is no condemnation for her withdrawal of sex, nor for her relationship with her doctor friend. Was this the female herd instinct or is it the fact that some, perhaps most, women do not not see any need for constancy in a relationship with a man.

    And to answer the question posed, I think there is a song that tells us: The Twelfth of Never

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  13. @ UK Fred,
    That point you raise is, unfortunately a very accurate portrayal of reality even, or perhaps especially, within the church. Women, for the most part, fail to hold their sister’s accountable for even the most blatant wrongs. If we look at the tone of things on various message boards, “hey what you are doing is wrong” is something we rarely, if ever hear spoken from one woman to another. And while I believe that men could do better at it than they do, they are still light years ahead of women when it comes to holding each other accountable for obvious wrongs.

  14. I dont care about hair splitting over Adam and Eve anymore.

    I do care that women are not help to account. They are held literally to no standard, if a standard is something immovable.

    I have examples of this in my life as does every man who reads this. I have a wife, she has sisters and friends, I know the husbands, BIL’s and the ones who are just friends, hence, I KNOW things, complete pictures of things, and they show me boldly that women do not hold each other to account…..period. Sadly the men do not even see this. They see women circling up and conflate that with accountability. In fact its a support system for “follow your heart sweety and we are here for you”

    There are a handful of things that must be fixed if marriage was to be a good bet again. This notion of female accountability is about as basic as it gets

  15. I agree that sin is sin and nothing that one person does lessens the responsibility on the other who sins for that sin. I also believe though that different sins can look like they are almost cause and effect when they aren’t. In your example, the man who sins by going out and getting sex elsewhere because his spouse is constantly refusing is sinning and is 100% responsible for that sin. But in that case, she is sinning too because refusal to that point is also definitely a sin. What bugs me about trying to discuss things like that though is that her sin can’t be mentioned without someone saying that his sin is being excused or justified.

  16. I generally liked the movie “Courageous” until it got to the end. (spoiler alert in case anyone wants to watch it)

    The whole idea about a bunch of guys wanting to live lives of greater integrity and all that–nothing inherently wrong with that. I liked that the one guy was going to spend more time with his son, that kind of thing, be an example. What bothered me and one of the other guys (some of the guys I volunteered with and one of the homeless guys who was living at our church) was the comment that I’m paraphrasing: “We are glad for the wives and mothers who have been doing their best, but now it’s time for us to step up.” We expressed, to one another, frustration that so often in our culture women are always doing their best, and men always need to step up. We talked about the abusive, addicted, violent women we’ve known, we talked about women who just did what they felt like no matter what the drama it cost or the emotional suffering it cost, and how they are not truly held accountable as a demographic. They are even dismissed as a demographic.

    What is there in the Bible that mirrors this? Does the Bible not tell everyone they need to step up? I can see now why over a year ago when I mentioned this idea on the Christian Forums it met with irritation from some of the guys–I literally meant the first two thirds of the movie step up but I was also still a Blue Pill kinda guy then.

    Fireproof is just as bad of course. Women can’t have it both ways though: either men lead and women follow, or men and women walk hand in hand and are equally held accountable. So the comment by RICanuck is a significant one–CAN women generally be held accountable? Because so far I think a number of us are coming to the conclusion that they cannot or won’t, that those who do are in the minority.

  17. Of the four movies that Sherwood has produced, Flywheel,Facing the Giants, Fireproof and Courageous, Courageous is far and away the least offensive of the bunch. Given the ending, it’s still plenty problematic, and definitely the overall message falls squarely into the same tired old “come on guys step up” meme.

    But the presence of so many “men step up” messages and the complete lack of similar to women pretty much supports the main idea behind the OP of this “thread”. That women(as a whole) will not accept any form of accountability for their own actions.

  18. We are past their not accepting it being the problem. Now it truly is on men, men wont attempt to hold women to account.
    We will not convince women to suddenly self police voluntarily.
    So, men….step up

  19. Which leaves us with MGTOW, a marriage strike if you will as being about the last possible hope. And even that, within the current thought framework, would just be seen as another “what’s wrong with you idiot men?” In reading here, at Dalrock, and even some rare outliers on CF, there are a few women who get it. However it’s FAR from a critical mass. But as I’ve said before, the start of the solution is going to have to come from women. Any man pointing it out, no matter how well reasoned his case, will be accused of not being able to deal with women being equal or some equally nonsensical attack/dismissal.

  20. Eve… made a choice.
    When will all the other women on my sphere learn they have a choice too – just like all men already know at birth.

    Women – not women.
    Demons.
    Unless they PROVE otherwise.
    Actions speak way louder than thoughts, opinions – or words.

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